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2/26/2016 7:32 pm  #1


God's Powers and Causation

It occurs to me that God has two (which are possibly one) utterly unique powers: creation and the sustaining of being.

The question is whether either of these are properly any of the classical causes. The creation of matter from nothing cannot (on threat of heresy) be material, is not formal, is not efficient, is not final, is not paradigmatic, is not instrumental. So what is it?


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2/26/2016 7:42 pm  #2


Re: God's Powers and Causation

iwpoe wrote:

It occurs to me that God has two (which are possibly one) utterly unique powers: creation and the sustaining of being.

The question is whether either of these are properly any of the classical causes. The creation of matter from nothing cannot (on threat of heresy) be material, is not formal, is not efficient, is not final, is not paradigmatic, is not instrumental. So what is it?

Granted creatio ex nihilo is a unique form of casual relation that alone is no reason for us not class it as an act, the ultimate act, of efficient causation. Traditionally this is what it has been classed (later of course the very term 'causation' became synonymous with 'efficient causation').

There is a very bad atheist argument I've seen parroted out from time to time to the effect that creatio ex nihilo must be impossible because every instance of causation of which we are aware involves a material cause. Not only is it question-begging but it over-looks the fact that if the theist's proofs are cogent we know that of necessity there has to be at least one example of causation not acting on a prior material body (it's equivalent to the old Humean objection to the OA which was to claim there are no necessary beings despite the OAer having claimed not only that there are but that he/she can offer a proof for one).

 

2/26/2016 7:43 pm  #3


Re: God's Powers and Causation

iwpoe wrote:

It occurs to me that God has two (which are possibly one) utterly unique powers: creation and the sustaining of being.

The question is whether either of these are properly any of the classical causes. The creation of matter from nothing cannot (on threat of heresy) be material, is not formal, is not efficient, is not final, is not paradigmatic, is not instrumental. So what is it?

Doesn't this involve creating matter for its own sake (i.e. as a final cause)? I mean, I believe your thinking here is quite worthy of consideration but I only wish to point out that you might want to bear in mind that - at least as you are formulating it - it would seem you are thinking of matter as a kind of final cause in creation, at least from God's point of view (so to speak); but obviously you also take or understand this to not really be the case. That - at least from my perspective - may be partly the reason for your perplexity.

Last edited by Timocrates (2/26/2016 7:44 pm)


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2/26/2016 7:59 pm  #4


Re: God's Powers and Causation

Hmm. Let me think about that. I was leaning towards considering it its own kind of causation, utterly unique to God, but let me think about the possibility that it be final. The reason it won't work as an efficient cause is because it is not the change of anything into anything else. It cannot be material, unless you're a pantheist, because it is not done by virtue of the preexisting character of some substance: matter is not the extension of God's own substance.


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

2/26/2016 9:15 pm  #5


Re: God's Powers and Causation

iwpoe wrote:

Hmm. Let me think about that. I was leaning towards considering it its own kind of causation, utterly unique to God...

By 'it' here, do you mean matter or creation? It somewhat sounds like your presupposing the subject. I mean, are you saying that matter as a causal principle is "utterly unique to God"? Or that the power to create is? I think from what you have said you definitely believe the latter; but concerning the former there seems to me to be some ambiguity - at least I am having difficulty understanding your thinking here.

Last edited by Timocrates (2/26/2016 9:57 pm)


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2/26/2016 9:43 pm  #6


Re: God's Powers and Causation

The power to create matter is. I'm not an occasionallist.


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

2/27/2016 11:55 am  #7


Re: God's Powers and Causation

iwpoe wrote:

The reason it won't work as an efficient cause is because it is not the change of anything into anything else.

“An efficient cause is that which brings something into existence or changes it in some way.” (Scholastic Metaphysics, page 88). See Aquinas's use of cause in 44.1 and 45.2.2 of the Summa Theologica, as well.

The definition may have been expanded after Aristotle (who, after all, would have disagreed with most scholastics about creatio ex nihilo, and had less reason to reflect on it).

 

2/27/2016 5:07 pm  #8


Re: God's Powers and Causation

Hmm, yes, classically that definition would have had to tacitly include "...brings something into existence (from out of what already exists)". You could consider it an efficient cause on Feser's definition, but having brought about its effect from nothing, it would be structurally different from all other efficient causes. (Unless I'm wrong about ex nihilo, but I always understood the doctrine to teach creation from literally not anything at all.)

For reference:

Effecent cause can be stated more formally on a classical view as:

X is the efficient cause of effect Y insofar as X interacts with material M to bring about Y.

This definition makes it clear why efficient and material causation are seperated classically (while modern accounts of causation often have a hard time making this seperation understandable). Strictly, I ought to formally include the final and the formal cause (as well as the paridignmiatic and instrumental) in the definition also, but it's unecessary for our purposes.

On that definition I could call God the efficient cause of matter only insofar as I ignore that mater itself has no material cause which God might come to and effect into matter. This is why I'm inclined to call God's creation a unique causal power. I suppose we could change the definition for the sake of this one, albeit importan, instance, but this would clearly disunify the causes. An important aspect about classical causation is that the analysis of causation is a literal analysis. Those are the four (or six) parts of causation, they are not four differnt causes that happen to come together sometimes.


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

2/28/2016 12:03 am  #9


Re: God's Powers and Causation

iwpoe wrote:

I suppose we could change the definition for the sake of this one, albeit importan, instance, but this would clearly disunify the causes. An important aspect about classical causation is that the analysis of causation is a literal analysis. Those are the four (or six) parts of causation, they are not four differnt causes that happen to come together sometimes.

Well, suppose that creatio ex nihilo being an act of efficient causation entails that God can efficiently cause independently of the other causes. It doesn't follow that the four causes merely happen to come together sometimes. It just follows that efficient causation sometimes occurs independently from the other three causes in miraculous circumstances.

iwpoe wrote:

X is the efficient cause of effect Y insofar as X interacts with material M to bring about Y.

It would be good for communication if you post the definition of material cause you're using, as well.

 

2/28/2016 12:11 am  #10


Re: God's Powers and Causation

I'll give a formal definition of material cause later, but I was not aware that creation was usually considered a miracle out right. Indeed, on what usual definition of miracle would creation be a miracle since it cannot be outside the natural order when there is none.

On my reading, creation is synonymous with God's sustaining of being, and is a continuous never ending cause of all events at all times and all places.


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

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