Classical Theism, Philosophy, and Religion Forum / Eliminative materialism

**Posted by Due_Kindheartedness** 12/21/2018 9:33 pm

Ancient Greeks believed magnets were caused by rocks having souls. We know that this is stupid. Therefore the entire concept of souls is like believing magnets have souls.

Why is this an apples-and-oranges comparison?

**Posted by ClassicalLiberal.Theist** 12/21/2018 9:48 pm

Due_Kindheartedness wrote:
Ancient Greeks believed magnets were caused by rocks having souls. We know that this is stupid. Therefore the entire concept of souls is like believing magnets have souls.

Why is this an apples-and-oranges comparison?

Fallacy of accident?

**Posted by Due_Kindheartedness** 12/21/2018 10:14 pm

ClassicalLiberal.Theist wrote:
Due_Kindheartedness wrote:
Ancient Greeks believed magnets were caused by rocks having souls. We know that this is stupid. Therefore the entire concept of souls is like believing magnets have souls.

Why is this an apples-and-oranges comparison?
Fallacy of accident?

I don't understand what you mean.

**Posted by Due_Kindheartedness** 12/22/2018 12:07 am

Descartes believe in an immaterial substance and believed that magnetism was something that was just a physical mechanism. So just because the ancient greeks (and was it even every ancient greek? I don't know if Aristotle thought this theory was true). The two are not necessarily conjoined by logical necessity and I'm not even sure if they had a common origin.

**Posted by Due_Kindheartedness** 12/22/2018 12:26 am

ADDENDUM: Not ever Ancient Greek believed in this theory. Source.

Why the Heraclean stone attracts iron. Empedocles says that the iron is borne towards
the stone by the effluvia emanating from both and because the pores of the stone are
fitted to receive the effluvium of the iron. The effluvium of the stone then expels the air
from the pores of the iron. Once the air is expelled, the iron itself is carried along by the
abundant flow of the effluvium. Again, when the effluvium of the iron moves towards the
pores of the stone, which are fitted to receive it, the iron begins to move with it

**Posted by John West** 12/22/2018 10:59 am

Due_Kindheartedness wrote:
Ancient Greeks believed magnets were caused by rocks having souls. We know that this is stupid. Therefore the entire concept of souls is like believing magnets have souls.

Why is this an apples-and-oranges comparison?

Unlike the souls and magnets hypothesis, we don't know that the men and souls hypothesis is "stupid". (Indeed, since knowledge involves true belief, as an argument against souls this begs the question.)

There is a useful collection of links on eliminative materialism here.

**Posted by ClassicalLiberal.Theist** 12/22/2018 2:25 pm

Due_Kindheartedness wrote:
ClassicalLiberal.Theist wrote:
Due_Kindheartedness wrote:
Ancient Greeks believed magnets were caused by rocks having souls. We know that this is stupid. Therefore the entire concept of souls is like believing magnets have souls.

Why is this an apples-and-oranges comparison?
Fallacy of accident?
I don't understand what you mean.

The comparison appears to me to commit the fallacy of accident.

**Posted by John West** 12/22/2018 3:21 pm

Looking back over this, I misunderstood the argument in my first paragraph. To be honest, I'm still not entirely sure what the argument is.