Voted for a man endorsed by the KKK. A man who said grab women by the pussy. A man who wants to ban Muslim immigration. A man who wants to build a wall between the US and Mexico. I'm just speechless. I guess Plato and Aristotle where right when they said democracy leads to tyranny. 

AKG wrote:

I guess Plato and Aristotle where right when they said democracy leads to tyranny.

Well, that's what Plato thought, but Aristotle thought democracy was the corruption, of polity. Tyranny is the corruption of kingship.

Of course, things are more complicated than what Plato and Aristotle's theories of regimes can tell you. The United State has always been, and still is, a mixed regime. Depending on what one thinks of the American Founding, one might think that it started out with some strong aristocratic elements which became oligarchic. Depending on what one thinks of Trump, one might think that it is remaining oligarchic, or else becoming more democratic or tyrannical. And Plato and Aristotle don't have a whole lot to say about the resentment, alienation, and nationalism that contributed to Trump's victory.

Jeremy Taylor wrote:

To be fair, I don't think Trump can be held responsible for the endorsement of the KKK.

I agree. He does, though, have an opportunity to turn away his KKK, neo-Nazi, alt-right, etc. supporters, and I think he should do so unequivocally. The people who voted him in are currently an electoral force. Some people hope that he will change immigration policy in such a way that the people who voted him in will remain an electoral force. I just don't think that will work. We don't even know that he will build a wall. I think it's virtually certain that he won't deport millions of immigrants. But even if he did, that wouldn't necessarily save the GOP demographically. If he wants to leave a lasting impression on American politics, he has to stand for something other than white identity politics.

Jeremy Taylor wrote:

I don't know whether the wall will work, but personally I don't see any problem with restricting immigration. Twelve million illegal immigrants is absurd.

I don't have any beef with restricting immigration. If a wall could be done and would actually keep people out (I don't know if either of those things is true), then I wouldn't mind seeing a wall followed by amnesty for those who are presently here. That probably wouldn't be popular with much of his base, but I don't think they'd abandon him, and it would be conciliatory towards people who worry he will oppress them.

And I think it's just the best way to handle the issue. Mass deportations won't succeed, so if you can secure the boarder, it's best to regularize everyone here and start anew.

Jeremy Taylor wrote:

​I have a feeling Trump is not that enthusiastic about fighting the culture wars. He will probably try to pick conservative judges though.

I don't think he's too enthusiastic about fighting the culture wars, but conservatives aren't really looking for him to do so. They just want him to roll back some of Obama's antagonism. Obama started a ton of needless fights regarding transgender bathrooms, forcing nuns to provide contraception, etc. Much of this wasn't done through legislative means, so it can be easily reversed.

I suspect he'll nominate conservative judges, just because he has no reason not to. Those are the people he proposed before. I just hope he doesn't give up if he encounters any resistance, or anything.

Greg wrote:

AKG wrote:

I guess Plato and Aristotle where right when they said democracy leads to tyranny.

Well, that's what Plato thought, but Aristotle thought democracy was the corruption, of polity. Tyranny is the corruption of kingship.

Of course, things are more complicated than what Plato and Aristotle's theories of regimes can tell you. The United State has always been, and still is, a mixed regime. Depending on what one thinks of the American Founding, one might think that it started out with some strong aristocratic elements which became oligarchic. Depending on what one thinks of Trump, one might think that it is remaining oligarchic, or else becoming more democratic or tyrannical. And Plato and Aristotle don't have a whole lot to say about the resentment, alienation, and nationalism that contributed to Trump's victory.

What would be the source of Aristotelian theory of politics? Would it be his history of tutoring Alexander the Great?

There's this work called Athenian Constitution that used to be attributed to Aristotle. It's a straightforward history of Athens beginning with Solon. It's actually quite amazing how all forms of democracy, tyranny, and economic order and occasional social overhauls have been described there with all the justifications and consequences. Back then it was clear to rulers that the entire society needs occasional reset or restart economically and socio-politically. You have to do some major redistribution of wealth and titles every once in a while.

(It's in the Bible too, by the way, the year of Jubilee every fifty years or so, when all debts were supposed to be forgiven. That's not a small thing. In fact, failure to keep this Jubilee is implied to have been the reason for Babylonian captivity.)

Plato's major political work is of course The Republic, a description of a hopeful ideal. But even as a philosophical idealist musing, it contains some insightful observations of real-life people's psyche.