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3/06/2016 6:59 pm  #1


Hume on the Ego

So, I don't really like Hume except as a foil for better thinking. But I have been leveling a particular criticism of Hume for about 2 years and I wanted to see if anybody here who might have more expertise in Hume than I do thinks its actually got force:

1. Hume claims that there is no internal impression of the ego (we'll call this the empirical ego, using Kantian terminology), thus we cannot know the mind. This follows trivially from his particular empiricist epistemology.
2. Hume's entire philosophical account makes reference to and relies upon mental faculties (sensation, memory, rational faculties, imagination, etc).
3. But "when I turn inward" not only do I not see an empirical ego, I also do not see any of the faculties of the ego. Rather, I only see their products, i.e. I never see an object called memory producing a memory, but rather I only have the experience of a memory occur before me with no "impression" of its source.
4. Thus, I should be unable to know the faculties of the mind.
5. But if I don't know the faculties of the mind then it is impossible to write Hume's book.
:. Hume's entre project is incoherent.

Does anyone ever try to save Hume on this point? We clearly have to be able to know something about the mind if we are going to write a philosophy about the mind.

Last edited by iwpoe (3/07/2016 1:23 am)


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
 

3/07/2016 9:47 am  #2


Re: Hume on the Ego

iwpoe wrote:

1. Hume claims that there is no internal impression of the ego (we'll call this the empirical ego, using Kantian terminology), thus we cannot know the mind. This follows trivially from his particular empiricist epistemology.
2. Hume's entire philosophical account makes reference to and relies upon mental faculties (sensation, memory, rational faculties, imagination, etc).
3. But "when I turn inward" not only do I not see an empirical ego, I also do not see any of the faculties of the ego. Rather, I only see their products, i.e. I never see an object called memory producing a memory, but rather I only have the experience of a memory occur before me with no "impression" of its source.
4. Thus, I should be unable to know the faculties of the mind.

Well, I am anything but a Hume expert and I don't have my copy of the Treatise at hand, but I suppose one might attempt to infer (or, rather, might do so out of habit) from objects of various types (ideas and impressions of varying strength? of varying content?) to sameness of "cause" in faculties (sensation, memory, rationality, imagination).

That account faces some difficulties. Hume's account of causation and induction in terms of constant conjunction takes as its matter a lot of observed A-s causing B-s, but in this case one does not observe the purported cause. (Though Hume writes about this latter sort of inference in his Dialogues, correct?) But then there's a more general problem of how regularities are described. Hume wants a parsimonious account of mental objects according to which ideas and impressions differ only in degree/strength, but if they can therefore be described as falling under the same kind, then why should one infer to several faculties rather than just one?

 

3/07/2016 6:50 pm  #3


Re: Hume on the Ego

One of the core issues is also that Hume has no place for recognising the way we do know the faculties. I know my memory by way of being the agent of my memory: I don't see recall I do recollection and see the product. Knowing myself as subject-agent is nothing like a sense impression. One makes a mistake to try to model it upon sensation by "looking within" as Hume directs, to look for an ego-objet.


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

3/09/2016 1:36 pm  #4


Re: Hume on the Ego

Post this either on the subreddits of r/askphilosophy or r/philosophy. There are a few professional philosophers there that have strong grasps of anti-realism and Hume's approach to causation. You might get an answer to your formulation. 

 

3/09/2016 1:59 pm  #5


Re: Hume on the Ego

I've had piss poor experiences in the latter. I might try the former.


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

3/09/2016 2:00 pm  #6


Re: Hume on the Ego

Yeah, just stick to the former. The latter often devolves into a shitstorm. 

 

3/13/2016 11:51 am  #7


Re: Hume on the Ego

It seems to me that belief in the existence of a persisting self (for lack of a better term) is properly basic, in Plantinga's sense. That's not to say that reasons can't be offered in support of it, but those reasons tend to be different in kind from the kind we adduce for most other existence claims. They are, in Kant's sense, transcendental, i.e., necessary as a precondition of making other kinds of sense of things. Even Hume's "constant conjunction" account of causation presupposes some continuous vantage point from which "constant" can be noticed. Without that, we have only a temporal string of impressions, each a kind of windowless monad.

Some contemporary philosophers of mind are hyperventilating over the supposed "convergence"  between cognitive neuroscience and Buddhism's doctrine of "no-self". Personally, I see this convergence as a mark of the failure of both. For what it's worth, I think Barry Dainton (Liverpool) is doing some interesting work in this area. His short book, The Self, is worth a read.
 

 

3/13/2016 10:50 pm  #8


Re: Hume on the Ego

dingodile wrote:

It seems to me that belief in the existence of a persisting self (for lack of a better term) is properly basic, in Plantinga's sense. That's not to say that reasons can't be offered in support of it, but those reasons tend to be different in kind from the kind we adduce for most other existence claims. They are, in Kant's sense, transcendental, i.e., necessary as a precondition of making other kinds of sense of things. Even Hume's "constant conjunction" account of causation presupposes some continuous vantage point from which "constant" can be noticed. Without that, we have only a temporal string of impressions, each a kind of windowless monad.

Some contemporary philosophers of mind are hyperventilating over the supposed "convergence"  between cognitive neuroscience and Buddhism's doctrine of "no-self". Personally, I see this convergence as a mark of the failure of both. For what it's worth, I think Barry Dainton (Liverpool) is doing some interesting work in this area. His short book, The Self, is worth a read.
 

I'm not even sure Buddhism's doctrine amounts to an ontological claim. It seems to be some kind of ethico-practical doctrine about the importance of a practice of detachment from one's public identity. There's a fascinating line about this in Zen and the Art of archery where the archery teacher replies to a ontological objection as if that's entirely beside the point.

Last edited by iwpoe (3/13/2016 10:51 pm)


Fighting to the death "the noonday demon" of Acedia.
My Books
It is precisely “values” that are the powerless and threadbare mask of the objectification of beings, an objectification that has become flat and devoid of background. No one dies for mere values.
~Martin Heidegger
     Thread Starter
 

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